I can't believe we are already on episode 18!!!! Thank you to those of you supporting the podcast, and listening along, I really appreciate each and every one of you :)
In this episode, I had such an awesome conversation with Jasmine Harrison. Jasmine works as a project manager for non for profit environmental organisations, a career change she made after working within the fashion industry.
She also runs a website, and a blog which you can find the link to here:
The link to her post regarding this episode, with extra resources:
She shares super useful content, with a great balance between of educational things, inspirational things, and just some wonderful feel good stuff too, so I really recommend you check it out.
In this conversation, we talked about the work she does, the aims for her website, and the value in bringing a sense of community. We discuss the importance of creativity beyond artistic fields, and why taking an intersectional approach is so crucial in finding just and sustainable solutions.
I hope this episode brings you as much food for thought, education and inspiration as it did for me.
The work she does/bit of background
Jasmine used to work in the fashion industry, living in New York for 5 years and then LA for 2 years. LA wasn’t a great fit for her but it gave her a lot to think about – what she wanted for her life, what she wanted to contribute to the world.
Although she believes in the importance of fashion, she felt like working for a brand she didn’t quite agree with wasn’t what she wanted to continue doing.
She is greatly aware of how pressing the climate crisis is, how it’s impacting all of us, and it felt really important to her to feel like she was doing something to help in a more direct way, also supporting her community.
This led her to getting into the work she’s doing now for an environmental non-profit organisation. She discusses the complexities that can be faced when making a career change at a time many people her age were settling down, buying a house, getting promotions etc. she felt she still had some figuring out to do. Luckily, it all worked out really well for her.
Now, she works as a project manager for a coalition of environmental non-profit groups. National and international organisations.
With project management, it’s a lot of ‘people management. She finds it's most effective to connect with people as people. Of course, there are deadlines to meet, but it is so important to take the time to check in with the people you’re working with, and insure they feel supported and valued as human beings, not just employees.
She explains why this is also a crucial approach to help prevent people from getting burnt out, which is really easy to do, especially when causes are important. But we have to be aware of how much we are demanding, and remember that people are still people.
It's a much more pleasant working environment when you take the time to connect on a more human level.
She's so grateful to work for the boss she has, she feels she’s learned so much from her.
It's so important to recognise everyone’s humanity!! How lovely to hear this is her value when working with people.
Jasmine is also not hesitant to recognise and admit there are times where she’ll miss the mark with this, but she tries to check herself and encourage others to do that also.
We are all still learning!! None of us are perfect, there’s so much room for growth and being open to that is so important.
Setting up her website
"What do I want to contribute? Where do I see gaps where solutions can be presented?"
One of Jasmine's main focus points was on trying to build community.
“When it comes to any social justice cause, it’s very easy to feel behind the eight ball whenever you engage” - you can feel as though everyone seems to know everything already, and that you don’t know enough, which can be overwhelming.
Jasmine used a wonderful analogy for what she hoped her website could create – as if she was hosting a dinner party with people who didn’t know each other, all with different experiences, and useful knowledge to share with each other for inspiration and education. A feeling that there’s always a place for you and something for you to contribute, and learn.
She still feels she’s figuring out how to get there, but that is her aim for the platform. And similarly with her Sunday brunch blog posts (which are awesome). Sharing information and building genuine connections between people.
“You don’t have to know everything and be doing everything perfectly, there’s a place for you”
She's trying to plug the hole between information and the people in a way that feels accessible and something you want to engage in.
I love how she relates this to encompassing the Lagom notion – not too much, not an overwhelm of information, but a little bit of something to learn.
It’s a balance of eco-friendly, sustainable info with also a focus on well-being, recipes, nice music, ‘jazzy podcasts’, things to consider you as a whole person and nourish that, not just to outlay information.
“It’s a take what you need, leave what you don’t kind of thing”
We discuss the values she holds , including how creativity is so important, not just within the arts but for problem solving. I support this view so much – training as a dancer, and following a more artistic career path, I realised how important a creative focus was for challenging, questioning, considering different perspectives, all of which feel so important when problem solving.
Jasmine has always identified as someone who was creative, and decided from a very young age she wanted to be a fashion designer. When working in a more corporate space, she felt a tension between learning and following how things are done, and questioning the systems in place, challenging them in a respectful way.
She explains the importance of creativity in people management for the most effective working situations.
She really tries to incorporate some fun into the working environment also. “I feel like that’s missing from a lot of life in general… so we’re not just enduring for our entire lives”
Trying to approach things from different angles, and not just doing things how they’ve always been done – this can remind you of the values you hold and can bring to the world.
“Nobody thinks just like you, no one is going to have ideas just like you, nobody is going to be able to execute them just like you can”
Creativity too often just gets relegated to “it’s just painting, or it’s just dancing, or it’s just making music….. it is all those things, but it’s not just those things.”
Jasmine expresses how lucky she feels and how grateful she is to have such a supportive boss, encouraging of her ideas.
Mindful about accessibility – not as much of a focus in the environmental space and in discussions about climate crisis solutions.
“I truly believe that if we do not centre indigenous voices, marginalised voices, disabled people, issues surrounding accessibility in climate solutions, then they’re not solutions… it has to be an holistic approach”
Environmental injustice
We can’t view social justice and climate justice as separate issues. They are so interconnected!
“When it comes to the climate crisis, that is a human problem. Industrialisation, colonisation, capitalism has all rapidly sped us into the climate crisis that we are now living in”
The most privileged are really the most responsible for the damage, but those experiencing the most of the damage falls on marginalised communities, people of colour, disabled people.
In New Orleans, if you have to evacuate due to a hurricane, if you’re in a wheelchair for example, some of the shelters where you can be safe from the hurricane are not accessible. If you have a guide dog, or a service animal, you can’t bring them.
We need to make these things more accessible now, so that when we have a crisis, everyone can be supported and protected.
Flint Michigan – an area without clean water, still without clean water. It’s not just Flint Michigan. It’s a big problem across the US. Toxic chemicals leaching into waterways.
We can’t make blanket statements like ‘no bottled water’ when there are people who cannot access clean running water. Some people don’t have that choice, because in order to be safe they have to drink bottled water.
These are just a few examples of why intersectional environmentalism is so incredibly important.
You cannot remove the human element, as humans are impacting the climate, and the climate is impacting people. Solutions will look different for different communities, so the people within the communities need to be listened to and valued to come to just and sustainable solutions.
“Until everybody has access to clean running water, we can’t say ‘no plastic water bottles’” – we have to recognise we do not all have access to the same privileges and choices, and push to make climate solutions inclusive and accessible, otherwise they are not solutions.
“There’s one earth, there’s no other place for us to go. Anything happening on a microcosmic level has impacts on a macro level… it’s all connected and we should all care”
Every choice we make has an impact on someone else, and it’s so important we recognise this and make more conscious choices. Taking responsibility for our actions and choosing to make better decisions where we can.
Jasmine makes a really important point about how within such a capitalist society, with many people feeling overworked, and when this is the case it can be harder for people to empathise because you’re so burnt out yourself.
This is why building a sense of community is so important, so people feel cared for and supported. No one is getting left behind.
Importance of diversifying the narratives we hear
Currently, the environmental movement, and so many aspects of society are so narrowed – white washed, hearing from the most privileged, the wealthiest, able bodied, not at all representative of the society we live in.
“You don’t know what you don’t know….. but now you do, what are you going to do about it? Now I know, I’ve got to do something about it”
Jasmine makes so many great points about how there needs to be this quick shift from learning to acting upon what you learn. It is the action which helps to change things. This applies to all aspects of our lives, we need to apply the information we learn for it to be of value.
If you could reshape the environmental movement, how would you change it?
Centring indigenous voices in climate conversations. It’s significantly lacking.
Jasmine discusses the recent documentary Kiss the Ground, which although for the most part provided an important perspective/shared useful information, it lacked indigenous voices, which is bizzare when these concepts are the practices of indigenous communities which they have been doing for (thousands of years?)
She would like to see people with different disabilities centred more, not just within climate conversations but generally. When you begin to think about it, you can see how inaccessible the world we live in is for so many people!
Examples Jasmine gives – subway in New York. Certain stops have no elevator, only stairs, so if you are in a wheelchair, you can’t get off at these stops.
There are no sounds on street crossings, so if you are blind and cannot see the signal, how can you know it’s safe to cross the street?
If you were deaf, how would you know when directions are shouted over a tannoy announcing a travel change.
In discussions on climate solutions, Jasmine has been enjoying hearing from more young people, since the climate crisis is impacting us. She'd also like to hear more of these voices in spaces that have most typically held the most privileged, the whitest, the oldest.
“I think that there's wisdom and experience that can be shared and learned from that group, but we certainly need to open it up to the experience and wisdom that can be learned from indigenous people, disabled people, young people and people of colour”
I want to live in the world Jasmine would create….
We get so caught up in what’s happening in our immediate surroundings, its taking that moment to think about how different the world would be for you if you were born into a different situation.
Indigenous People’s day in America
‘Reclaim the Land’ has been a movement, along with the idea of reparation has been a conversation that indigenous people had been mostly left out of.
Indigenous People's Day began by a push from a committee in the UN to rename what used to be called Columbus Day in America.
Jasmine explains the damage and concern with naming a ‘holiday’ after a person who really ushered in genocide, colonisation and the stealing of land.
“Indigenous people are still in this country” and with renaming Columbus Day to Indigenous Peoples Day it can shine a light on that fact, celebrating and respecting their ways of life.
Jasmine had the opportunity to attend a pow wow a couple of years ago, where she got to learn about some of the traditions, different styles of dress, singing and the governing systems of tribes near where she lives.
Once people are able to safely gather again and attend a pow wow, she would really recommend people to go.
She stresses the importance of remembering you are a guest, and should be respectful as you’re given the opportunity to observe and learn about their way of life. She describes it as an incredibly rewarding and eye opening experience.
Indigenous People’s Day is a federal holiday now in America, however some states/counties sadly still do not recognise it, and continue to celebrate Columbus day….
The app ‘Who’s land’
You can just search for “who’s land am I on” on the internet, and the website will come up. It definitely works for America, but may not have information across other parts of the globe, but you just insert your address and it will tell you who’s land you’re on, the tribes who have that land, that has now been reclaimed, and you can learn things about their history.
Its nice to be reminded of that, and have another opportunity to engage in community, and think about “what does a solution look like for all of us, not just for me, but what does a solution look like for you as well?”
“Taking responsibility for the things you do wrong builds trust, and building trust builds community”
This again stresses why accountability is so important.
Oftentimes, people don’t want to take responsibility because they don’t want to be wrong. But we are all human, we are all going to get things wrong.
“If people can be gracious in admitting that they’re wrong, and people can be gracious in giving people space to admit that they’re wrong, we build trust, we build solutions, we build a happier world”
Infographic mentioned in the episode:
Original Editorial Cartoon by Graeme MacKay
It is being predicted that more pandemics may be to come as the climate crisis worsens – diseases trapped under ice will be released as they continue to melt!!
Covid is a huge concern and awful thing to be happening, but we can’t forget about all the other issues facing this world in the meantime.
Record setting hurricanes in America! Forest fires, flooding, pandemics.
Covid – some people say “we’re all in this together”, but we are not all experiencing it in the same way. Some people have had to isolate in a small flat with 5 other people for example, or had no other choice but to go into work even when it is not safe.
Not everyone can afford groceries delivered if they have to isolate, not everyone has access to green space. Reusable masks weren’t accessible from the beginning.
Unhoused people in the community and how the pandemic is influencing them, how extreme weather will impact them also. How awful the disparities are – for example, in Las Vegas, there were outside domes to allow people to practice yoga in their own individual domes, whilst Las Vegas is also struggling with how to provide housing for the unhoused…. What a huge disconnect!!!
Similarly, recently in the UK, the government refused to provide free school meals for kids of a lower socioeconomic background in the holiday period, whilst they would provide MP’s with £25 per day for their lunch….
Why is one person’s life valued so much more than someone elses'?
“It comes back to capitalism, you have to undervalue somebody in order to be able to exploit them for their labour, their time.”
And also Jasmine explains how there’s this mindset of believing someone’s situation is their fault, and as a result isn’t in their own responsibility to help improve their situation.
This comes back to recognising that working hard alone doesn’t ensure security, financial stability etc. there are other factors in play – circumstances that either help or hinder you throughout your life, certain privileges you have or do not have, and this plays a huge role in your situation.
We have to have faith in ripple effects. It can be so overwhelming and frustrating when we think about how much influence big corporations have, and the wealth of some individuals that is enough that could solve the climate crisis. It can be hard to feel like your actions can make a difference, but it comes back to community.
There is so much power in community.
Jasmine would really encourage people to think about how they can help build a sense of community where they live with what they have. Don’t leave it until later. Even just check in with friends, and people in your life to see how they’re doing, take a look into volunteering opportunities in your community.
“Contribute to building the world you want to see, don’t rely on someone else to build the world you want to see, and don’t diminish ourselves and our own capacity in building that world as well”
How do you find a little bit of Lagom in your life?
Reminding herself to be present and to slow down. The tendency can be to think about the future, what she wants to do where she wants to go, constantly striving for something that doesn’t even exist yet. But we have this moment right now… “how can I best honour that future-self by being present now”
For jasmine that has been practicing yoga, drinking tea in the morning, anything that reminds her to come back to herself, and to be grounded.
It was such a joy speaking with Jasmine, what an awesome woman, and I hope we will meet in person one day. You can find out more about what she's getting up to on Instagram @themodernboheme, and on her website:
I hope you enjoyed this episode, if you have any thoughts/questions, you can drop me a message on Instagram @alittlebitoflagom.
Sending you all the best wherever you are x